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19 April 2007

Armenian Revolt Video available on YouTube and for purchase

You can watch the whole film in 6 episodes starting with the one below:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZTEaJVDMoIo
You can also order a DVD for $11 shipping included:
http://www.atahouston.org/Default.aspx?tabid=147

This reached me through a message from the San Diego Turks Yahoo group. -AT

32 comments:

Sean said...

Robert Fisk: Caught in the deadly web of the internet

Any political filth or personal libel can be hurled at the innocent
Published: 21 April 2007

Could it possibly be that the security men who guard the frontiers of North America are supporting Holocaust denial? Alas, it's true. Here's the story.

Taner Akcam is the distinguished Turkish scholar at the University of Minnesota who, with immense courage, proved the facts of the Armenian genocide - the deliberate mass murder of up to a million and a half Armenians by the Ottoman Turkish authorities in 1915 - from Turkish documents and archives. His book A Shameful Act was published to great critical acclaim in Britain and the United States.

He is now, needless to say, being threatened with legal action in Turkey under the infamous Law 301 - which makes a crime of insulting "Turkishness" - but it's probably par for the course for a man who was granted political asylum in Germany after receiving an eight-year prison sentence in his own country for articles he had written in a student journal; Amnesty International had already named him a prisoner of conscience.

But Mr Akcam has now become a different kind of prisoner: an inmate of the internet hate machine, the circle of hell in which any political filth or personal libel can be hurled at the innocent without any recourse to the law, to libel lawyers or to common decency. The Armenian-Turkish journalist Hrant Dink was misquoted on the internet for allegedly claiming that Turkish blood was "poisonous"; this total lie - Dink never said such a thing - prompted a young man to murder him in an Istanbul street.

Read the entire article at:
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fisk/article2469270.ece

Finduk O. said...

The following is an exact quote from the director of this documentary, who I had tracked down regarding "Armenian Revolt":

You may purchase DVD copies of "The Armenian Revolt" for $10 apiece. Please make check payable to Third Coast Films and send to:

Third Coast Films, P.O. Box 664, Clarion, PA 16214.

----please no hate mail to this person. he has a series of documentaries on various subjects and doesn't need his POB overwhelmed with anything other than his original intention in giving out the address.

Sean said...

Finduk said "he doesn't need his POB overwhelmed with anything other than his original intention in giving out the address"

so basically, what you are saying is that he is happy to cash the checks, but he doesn't want to face the response from the other side about the lies that he included in his so-called "documentary".

We have discussed this at length on Infidel's site, so I won't go into it again.

In the absence of dissent, anything one says would be presumed to be the Truth. When you allow the opposition to point out the weaknesses of your argument, the Truth comes out. Hence, the reason for 301 and the request from your so-called director.

az said...

sean said....

so basically, what you are saying is that he is happy to cash the checks, but he doesn't want to face the response from the other side about the lies that he included in his so-called "documentary".


What are you hiding from Sean, you delete every comment I have thus far posted on your blog, yet you have the nerve to say " but he doesn't want to face the response from the other side about the lies that he included in his so-called "documentary".

What are you afraid of post the comments, just like Murat does, or shut the F**k Up about 301.

You are a HYPOCRITE, you've made that very clear.

az said...

Your comment has been saved and will be visible after blog owner approval.

Sean's Blog and how he shows his distaste for 301.

Sean said...

Az, I would try to explain it to you once again, but you don't seem to get it, so I won't waste my time.

As you can see, everyone else simply ignores you, which will be my approach to your so-called useless "comments" from now on.

Sean said...

Here is an honest look at the situation, from a fellow Turk:

http://www.talkturkey.us/2007/04/dick_gephardt_t.html

Sean said...

Turkish newspapers think that Turks are CLUELESS.

That must be the case. Otherwise, why would 2 of them print the same article insulting the intelligence of their readers.

Here is the article I am talking about: http://english.sabah.com.tr/C4213D15C63E4289B5DA3DDB290E142A.html
and here:
http://www.turkishweekly.net/news.php?id=44436

The Turkish Weekly and Sabah must think that their readers, who are presumably mostly Turks, don't know anything and will believe everything they read.

Would you like me to prove it? I will be happy to.

In this article, they claim that "a Swedish commander staying in Anatolia as observer refuted Armenian genocide claims in a letter he wrote in 1917. Commander says: 'as an eye witness, I object to genocide claims.'"

Do you see the problem? If not, then I guess you are the type of reader that these papers are hoping to trick.

Every Turk and Armenian, who can spell his own name, knows that the word "genocide" was created in 1943 by Raphael Lemkin.

Therefore, HOW IS IT POSSIBLE that in 1917 this so-called commander wrote a letter and said "I OBJECT TO GENOCIDE CLAIMS"? The word itself wasn't going to be created until 26 years later!! How many people would fall for this cheap trick? This article is a pour fabrication, just like all the arguments against the Armenian Genocide.

I can't believe that they would print this obvious lie on the eve of April 24th!!

Go ahead, try to defend this one. Tell me how this was a lost-in-translation problem. Even if that's true...

A person living in 1917 would not have realized that he or she was in the middle of a Genocide. A genocide, by its very nature, is not something that you can recognize after 1 day or 1 month. You have to look at the bigger picture, analyze the extend of it, look at the intent. This is the reason why the Genocide in Sudan was not talked about much until recently.

Just look at all the Jews who boarded the trains during WWII, not realizing that the train was headed towards a camp. They even went into the chambers, thinking that they were about to take a shower!!

Somehow, the so-called historians from Turkey, have discovered a letter 92 years later, written by a so-called commander, who happened to look at the big picture and state "as an eye witness, I object to genocide claims."

"eye witness?" - Eye witness to what? Did he travel to all the different cities where the Armenians were being murdered, conducted research, and made an observation of his eye witness account?

"I object" - what was he objecting to? did he think he was in court? who talks like that?

"genocide claims" - the Armenians in 1917 were not making genocide claims. they were too busy trying to stay alive. To suggested that in 1917 the genocide claims had already come to light and were being objected to is ridiculous by itself, even if we assume that the word "genocide" was already being used by this person who was well ahead of his time.

I will repeat my claim: Turkish newspapers think that Turkish readers are clueless. Only a clueless person would fall for this one. It would have been better if they had printed this article on April 1, for April Fools Day!

How can readers believe ANYTHING these papers write, when it's clear that they are willing to say anything, as long as it's to their advantage, no matter how blatantly wrong they are.

Anonymous said...

So called genocide is a provocation and is part of 'Great Middle East Project' to pull Turks into the ongoing wars of that region.
Armenians at it, as usual, trying to grab whatever they can. West dangles the carrot, Armenians and Kurds chase it. History repeats itself...

az said...

Sean, you just proved how stupid you are. If you like me to prove to you just how stupid you are, just ask, I'm here for you.



The situation of the Armenians: By one who was among them

By Hj Pravitz, Nya Dagligt Allehanda, 23 April, 1917

Hj Pravitz takes a deeper look at the statements that had previously been made by Mrs. Marika Stjernstedt, in Nya Dagligt Allehanda, a Swedish Newspaper published in the period 1859-1944.

*******************



"…Recently returned home from abroad I have right now – i.e. somewhat late – had the opportunity to look at two Swedish booklets on the Armenian issue. "Sven Hedin — adelsman" [Sven Hedin — a nobility], by Ossiannilsson and "Armeniernas fruktansvärda läge" [the terrible situation of the Armenians], by Marika Stjernstedt. The former book went immediately in the waste basket. In all its poorly hidden appreciation of the title character, it annoyed me more than a main article in Dagens Nyheter. The latter, which seemed spirited by the compassion for the suffering Armenians, I have read repeatedly, and it is really this and its inaccuracies that my article is about.

I dare to claim, that hardly any other Swede has had the opportunity like me, to thoroughly and closely study the misery among the Armenians, since I now for about a month have traveled right among all the emigrating poor people. And this, during the right time, fall 1915, during which the alleged brutalities, according to both writers, were particularly bad.

I want to hope, that what I am describing below, which are my own experiences, will have the purpose to remove the impression of inhumanity and barbarity from the Turkish and German side, which is easily induced by the reading of the two booklets mentioned above.

If I understand the contents of the books correctly, both writers want to burden the Turks as well as the Germans with deliberate assaults or even cruelties.


Hj Pravitz

My position as an imbedded eyewitness gives me the right and duty to protest against such claims, and the following, based on my experiences, will support and strengthen this protest.

Despite the fact that I was and am such a pronounced friend of Germany and its allies, which is consistent with the position of a servant of a neutral country, I started my journey from Konstantinopel (Istanbul) through the Asian Turkey, with a certain prejudiced point of view, partly received from American travelers, about the persecution of the Armenians by their Turkish masters. My Lord, which misery I would see, and to which cruelties I would be a witness! And although my long service in the Orient has not convinced me that the Armenians, despite their Christianity, are any of God’s best children, I decided to keep my eyes open to see for myself to which extent the rumors about Turkish assaults are true and the nameless victims were telling the truth.

I sure got to view misery, but planned cruelties? Absolutely nothing.

This is precisely why it has appeared to me to be necessary to speak up.

To start with, it is unavoidable to state, that a transfer of the unreliable Armenian elements from the northern parts of the Ottoman Empire to the south was done by the Turkish government due to compulsory reasons.

It should have been particularly important to remove, from the Erzeroum district, all these settlers, who only waited for a Russian invasion to join the invading army against the hated local legal authority. When Erzeroum fell in February 1916, an Armenian, with whom I just shared Russian imprisonment, uttered something I interpreted as 'It would have fallen way earlier if we had been allowed to stay.' That a country like Turkey, threatened and attacked by powerful external enemies, is trying to secure itself against cunning internal enemies, no one should be able to blame her.

I think it points to a misconception when one claims that the Armenians are living under the uninterrupted distress of some sort of Turkish slavery. There are peoples that have it worse. Or what about Indian Kulis and Bengalis under British rule, and the Persian nationalists in Azerbaijan under the Russians' — "penétration pacificue", and the Negroes in Belgian Congo, and the Indians in the Kautschuk district in French Guyana. All these, not to mention many others, seem to me, are victimized to a higher degree and more permanently than the Armenians. I guess technically, one can say that a longer lasting but milder persecution is less bearable to endure than a bloody but quick act of despotism, as in (Ottoman) assaults of the kind that from time to time put Europe's attention on the Armenian issue. Apart from these periodical so-called massacres, the reason of which could to a large degree be ascribed to the Armenians themselves, I do think that the (Armenians) are treated reasonably well.

The (Armenians) have their own religion, their own language, both in speaking and writing, their own schools etc.

As far as the much discussed major Armenian migration is concerned, I am the first to agree that the attempts of the Turkish side to reduce the difficulties of the refugees left a lot to be desired. But I emphasize again, in the name of fairness, that considering the difficult situation in which Turkey, as the target of attack from three powerful enemies, was in and it was, in my opinion, almost impossible for the Turks, under these circumstances, to have been able to keep up an orderly assistance activity.

I have seen these poor refugees, or "emigrants", to use Tanin’s words, seen them closely. I have seen them in the trains in Anatolia, in oxen wagons in Konia and elsewhere, by foot in uncountable numbers up in the Taurus mountains, in camps in Tarsus and Adana, in Aleppo, in Deir-el-Zor and Ana.

I have seen dying and dead along the roads — but among hundreds of thousands there must, of course, occur casualties. I have seen childrens' corpses, shredded to pieces by jackals, and pitiful individuals stretch their bony arms with piercing screams of "ekmek" (bread).

But I have never seen direct Turkish assaults against the ones hit by destiny. A single time I saw a Turkish gendarme in passing hit a couple of slow moving people with his whip; but similar things have happened to me in Russia, without me complaining, not then, nor later.

In Konia, there lived a French woman, Madame Soulié, with family and an Italian maid. They lived there, despite the war, and the Turks did them no harm. And as far as the Germans stationed in the town are concerned, she called them 'our angels.' 'They give all they have to the Armenians!.' Such evidence of German readiness to sacrifice I established everywhere the Germans were.

In Aleppo, I lived by the Armenian Báron, the owner of a large hotel. He did not tell me about any Turkish cruelties, although we talked a lot about the situation of his fellow citizens. We also talked about Djemal Pasha, who would come the day after and with whom I would meet. Báron expressed himself very positively about this man, who by the way, least of all seemed like an executioner.

In Aleppo, I hired an Armenian servant, who then during a couple of months was my daily company. Not a word has he told me about Turkish cruelties, neither in Aleppo nor in his home town of Marash or elsewhere. I must unconditionally believe in exaggerations from Mrs. Stjernstedt’s side and I do not put one bit of confidence in the Armenian authorities she claims to refer to.

On page 44, Mrs. Stjernstedt writes about (the town of) Meskene and an Armenian doctor Turoyan. I was in Meskene right when he was supposed to have been there. I looked carefully around everywhere for historical landmarks, since Alexander the great crossed the Euphrates (river) here, and the old testament also talks about this place. There was not a sign of Armenian graves and not of any Armenians either, except for my just mentioned servant. I consider Mr. Turayan’s evidence very questionable, and I even dare to doubt that this man, if he exists, was ever there during the mentioned time. If the conditions in Meskene really were as he claims, will anyone then believe that the suspicious Turks would have sent an Armenian up there with a "mission from the government"?

For fourteen days, I followed the Euphrates; it is completely out of the question that I during this time would not have seen at least some of the Armenian corpses that, according to Mrs. Stjernstedt’s statements, should have drifted along the river en masse at that time. A travel companion of mine, Dr. Schacht, was also travelling along the river. He also had nothing to tell when we later met in Baghdad.

In summary, I think that Mrs. Stjernstedt, somewhat uncritically, has accepted the hair-raising stories from more or less biased sources, which formed the basis for her lecture.

By this, I do not want to deny the bad situation for the Armenians, which probably can motivate the collection initialized by Mrs. Stjernstedt.

But I do want to, as far as it can be considered to be within the powers of an eyewitness, deny that the regular Turkish gendarme forces, who supervised the transports, are guilty of any cruelties.

Later on, in a different format, I want to impartially and neutrally like now treat the Armenian issue, but at the moment, may the adduced be enough.

Rättvik, April 1917

HJ Pravitz.

Sean said...

az, you just proved how stupid you are. If you like me to prove to you just how stupid you are, just read your own comments.

You prove that you are stupid. You don't need me to prove it to you.

Anonymous said...

Sean said...
Az,

from now on, ALL of your comments will be automatically rejected. Why? because you are an Idiot!

It's that simple. It's not because I agree with 301, it's not because I disagree with your views. It's just because you have nothing of value to add.

April 23, 2007 4:08 PM

HYPOCRITE. I am glad to hear that you do not agree with 301(Action does speak louder than words, which contradicts your statement) and you agree with my views, why not post my comments and let your readers decide if they are of value or not. What are you afraid of? Why not let people judge for themselves if I have anything to add.

Sean, sometimes I wonder if you are mentally challenged. Really.
You contradict and presume and imply things that are not based in reality.

Sean said...

Read this article:
http://www.todayszaman.com/tz-web/detaylar.do?load=detay&link=109390&bolum=102

This was an attempt by a Turkish historian and a Swedish historian to get to the truth on this one specific issue. What happened? Turkey either took the Swedish historian to the wrong site or they completely cleaned the site before they allowed him to examine it.

This is the prefect example of why Armenians don't trust the so-called opening of the archives by the Turks. Every documents that is open for examination has been examined and reexamined over and over again, to make sure no incriminating evidence is left.

You don't believe me? How do you explain this very article, from a Turkish newspaper, proving that the Turks are destroying evidence in this very day?

The historian is Swedish, not Armenian, so you can't accuse him of lying. In fact, the Turks were the ones that agreed to let him examine the site. If they had thought that he was not credible, they wouldn't have agreed to it.

Another attempt by the Turks to cover up the Truth has backfired. Turkish government may think that they are fooling people, but the only fools here are the ones calling the shots in Turkey. No one, not even Turks, are being fooled, thanks to the free information available on the net. No wonder the Turkish government wants to block all websites that contain information they don't agree with. They just want to keep their people blind and deaf.

THIS IS YOUR TURKEY!!

Anonymous said...

Yes, it is ours. So, mind your own business you saddo!

Sean said...

cover-up of the graves of my ancestors by a government claiming to have opened it's archives and claiming that nothing happened IS MY BUSINESS, YOU SADDO. Get used to it.

In case you haven't noticed, every year the Armenians are getting more and more attention. The Truth is emerging. More and more Turks are starting to realize that the Armenians have been right all along. Ignorant people like you (anonymous) are in the minority and shrinking fast.

Unfortunately, there are many people like you still around. Most of them are running the Turkish government. Thanks to people like you, people like me are getting results.

Take your last few breaths.

Anonymous said...

how do you cover-up 1.5 million alleged graves?

Sean said...

How do you cover up graves? well, for starters, Turkey has had 92 years to do it.

Here is one great example of it, happening today:

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/article.php?enewsid=71759

Sean said...

Murat, I am waiting to get your take on this mass grave cover-up story. If I remember correctly, you said that the Turkish archives are open. Why don't the Armenians open their and come look at the Turkish ones?

I think this story answers that question. (see my last post above for the link).

any comments, Murat? Do you condemn or condone this behavior?

Anonymous said...

No genocide happened in early 1900 in Ottoman Turkey. Trying to invade Turkey by making up dramatic lies is not going to work. These are the new war cries from the West, again their eyes on our land. Using few saddo Armenians or Kurds or whoever is not going to work. It did not work in the past. If you are ithching again, no problem we'll scratch...
We will be independent and undivided forever..

Anonymous said...

For starters according to your calculations there should be grave sites all over Turkey.

Why would a nation that is being attacked on all fronts, and in dire need of ALL its Citizens to take up arms against its enemies. decide to kill the alleged 1.5 million of its Armenian citizens?
That makes no sense what so ever.

Please dont reply by saying that it was so they could hide the fact behind the clouds of war.

Why not wait till the war is over?

If its because of religeon, fine then again wait till the war is over then kick them out of Turkey on grounds of treason?

Unless of course these so-called Armenian-Turkish citizens are traitors and are in cohoots with the enemy and need to be taken care of now.

az said...

Armenians have a ridiculous explanation for everything. I find that to be true with the Armenians who visit this site as well.

Main article: Nagorno-Karabakh war
Prior to the attack, the town had been without electricity and gas for several months.[5]


The massacre
According to Human Rights Watch, the tragedy struck when “a large column of residents, accompanied by a few dozen retreating fighters, fled the city as it fell to Armenian forces. As they approached the border with Azerbaijan, they came across an Armenian military post and were cruelly fired upon”.[6]

The Armenian side states that the killings occurred as a result of wartime military operations, and were in part caused by the prevention of the evacuation of town inhabitants by Azerbaijani forces. Armenian government officials asserted that the casualty count, though high, was due to the fact the fleeing civilians in Khojaly had mingled with the retreating defenders and when the Azeri troops shot back, Armenian forces fired upon them, killing both soldier and civilian alike. Helsinki Watch itself concluded "that the militia, still in uniform, and some still carrying their guns, were interspersed with the masses of civilians." [7] However, Human Rights Watch and Memorial, found this explanation unconvincing, stating that the mass killing of civilians could not be justified under any circumstances. Human Rights Watch noted that “the attacking party [i.e., Karabakh Armenian forces] is still obliged to take precautionary measures to avoid or minimize civilian casualties. In particular, the party must suspend an attack if it becomes apparent that the attack may be expected to cause civilian casualties that are excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated."[8]

The Armenian side oft-referred to Ayaz Mutalibov's interview to claim that the massacre had been committed not by Armenian soldiers but by Azerbaijan Popular Front militants who allegedly shot their own civilians escaping through the corridor. In one of his interviews Mutalibov stated that the event could be a ploy by opposition to denigrate his government. In later interviews, however, Mutalibov would go on to condemn the Armenians for what he said was a misinterpretation of his words.[9] Other theories proposed by the Armenian side were that Azeri Popular Front soldiers had massacred 100 Azeri and Armenian civilians and then proceeded to mix the bodies and lay blame upon the Armenians.[10]

This explanation however is widely disputed, among others, the executive director of Human Rights Watch has stated that: “we place direct responsibility for the civilian deaths with Karabakh Armenian forces. Indeed, neither our report nor that of Memorial includes any evidence to support the argument that Azerbaijani forces obstructed the flight of, or fired on Azeri civilians”.[11]

At the same time, some Armenian sources admitted the guilt of the Armenian side. According to Markar Melkonian, the brother of the Armenian military leader Monte Melkonian, "Khojaly had been a strategic goal, but it had also been an act of revenge." The date of the massacre in Khojaly had a special significance: it was the run-up to the fourth anniversary of the anti-Armenian pogrom in the city of Sumgait which was the Sumgait Massacre. Melkonian particularly mentions the role of the fighters of two Armenian military detachments called the Arabo and Aramo, who stabbed to death many Azeri civilians.[12]

According to Serge Sarkisian, long-time Defense Minister and Chairman of Security Council of Armenia, “A lot was exaggerated” in the casualties, and the fleeing Azerbaijanis had put up armed resistance. At the same time he stated: “before Khojali, the Azerbaijanis thought that they were joking with us, they thought that the Armenians were people who could not raise their hand against the civilian population. We were able to break that [stereotype]. And that's what happened. And we should also take into account that amongst those boys were people who had fled from Baku and Sumgait".

Sean said...

Two Jewish leaders show their support for the Armenian Genocide:

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-myers1may01,0,2074553.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

Anonymous said...

Well done those Jews! Since they say so, the whole world will now accept it as a fact...I wonder what your best friend Mr Fisk thinks about that..

Sean said...

You are my only TRUE best friend. Fisk is just a friend.

Sean said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sean said...

I bet some of the people who post as anonymous on this blog were here, "inciting riots":

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/02/nyregion/02reading.html


http://www.nytimes.com/
2007/05/02/nyregion/02reading.html

Anonymous said...

No, you are wrong.. We're too busy laughing at you...Your exaggarations and the drama that goes with it..Ever considered being a comedian?

Sean said...

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-le-thursday3.1may03,1,1269674.story?coll=la-news-comment

Anonymous said...

Do you think we're bothered to look at your links? You have no credibility....

Sean said...

Anonymous,

If the article had been written by me or another Armenian, your comment may have actually been worth the time I spent reading it, however, it's comments in LA Times, written by the President of American Jewish Committee at Los Angeles. Therefore, my credibility is NOT at issue here.

As far as YOU reading it is concerned, I don't care whether you read it or not. If people like you actually read, they would change their opinion about 95% of the things you believe in. Therefore, it doesn't surprise me that you don't read. The only information you receive is the crap regurgitated by the Turkish military and government and passed down by the state owned media.

If you read one independent article, your brain would explode or you would be put in jail (without a trial) for insulting yourself.

Sean said...

Anonymous,

here is another article you SHOULD NOT read. It's from the Jewish Journal.

Moreover, there is a link on there to a video made by National Geographic. There is nothing to read there, one just would watch it, but even that could be dangerous for you. So - please - don't even think about it.

http://www.jewishjournal.com/home/preview.php?id=17609

Anonymous said...

No,I won't...But,thanks anyway...